Not corpos, though. Corpos have deals with all platforms, they’re not concerned about positioning on Steam. Valve will go to them, and if they don’t their marketing budget will carry them.
No, it’s the indies who end up bending over backwards to fit Valve’s marching orders. It was contentious for a while, during the awkward period when Steam was figuring out how to crowdsource store placement. Now that they’ve successfully done so they invest very little and get to tell indies what to spend their budgets on, which they do often and explicitly.
If I had to compare the relationship, it’s closest to Youtube and content creators. Have you noticed how every Youtube video now has a little intro with highlights from later on? Like that.
You get nothing from those compared to Steam, though. The only third party that can compete, and that’s declined a bit, is Nintendo. And Nintendo is a bit of an additive thing, anyway. It’s where you go when you can afford it or got big enough on Steam to get some attention.
I’m not gonna say it’s impossible to survive around the edges of Steam, but man, if you’re an indie dev and Valve says jump you are up in the air before you even ask how high.
I have to say, it’s crazy how many things get more palatable in these conversation when you point out that Valve does them. Microtransactions, cosmetics, NFTs, content creation guidelines… it’s a lot easier to get people to admit the upsides when it’s those guys.
Which is fair. The thing is I’m not even against most of those practices in principle, and I agree that Valve are good at making them smooth and friendly. The big exceptions are the absolute mess they made of crowdsourcing store curation and the ungodly mess of the CSGO skin grey market. And they have more than enough brand clout to get those swept under the rug. Coca Cola wishes they had the brand loyalty Valve gets.
I guess technically video creators don’t work for Youtube, although that one is murkier. Steam is a storefront.
Think of Amazon, actually. That’s probably a better comparison. Amazon workers work for Amazon. Their relationship with Amazon has to do with labour conditions and so on.
But if you’re a seller, or a small store that tries to sell online your relationship with Amazon is not a labour relationship but it’s still extremely asymmetrical. You have no power in that dynamic.
I mean, you’re absolutely right, that’s modern late-stage capitalism. The astounding thing is how well Valve manages to position itself outside that. Just look at all the pushback that pointing that out gets you in this and other threads. Poeple HATE the idea that Valve exists in that space. “Good guy Valve” is deeply ingrained and it demands that you think about them in a different way than Amazon and Youtube.
There’s nuance to it. You can’t ever get good enough at driving that Uber gives you a special deal, and you aren’t selling each of your rides to people on multiple services at once. The power dynamic isn’t quite as lopsided, at least not for everybody.
But… it’s also not completely different, especially for the smaller devs. Valve definitely comes from that same tech upstart mentality, and it only drifted further into it as they stopped being primarily a game developer and became primarily a storefront.
Piracy and its interactions with indie development are way more nuanced than that, but sure, yeah, Valve is a corporation like any other corporation. That’s all I’m saying.
That their branding work spares them a lot of criticism and judgement from the same industry-standard practices that are seen as an affront elsewhere in both game development and the larger online content creation industry.
To add to this comment, remember that the base cut is 30%, but it goes down to 25% and later to 20% as the game reaches certain thresholds of revenue. This isn’t meant to shake down the large corporations (indies benefit the least from this policy), but to make their system appealing enough to developers large enough to be able to try their luck somewhere else.
Not corpos, though. Corpos have deals with all platforms, they’re not concerned about positioning on Steam. Valve will go to them, and if they don’t their marketing budget will carry them.
No, it’s the indies who end up bending over backwards to fit Valve’s marching orders. It was contentious for a while, during the awkward period when Steam was figuring out how to crowdsource store placement. Now that they’ve successfully done so they invest very little and get to tell indies what to spend their budgets on, which they do often and explicitly.
If I had to compare the relationship, it’s closest to Youtube and content creators. Have you noticed how every Youtube video now has a little intro with highlights from later on? Like that.
deleted by creator
You get nothing from those compared to Steam, though. The only third party that can compete, and that’s declined a bit, is Nintendo. And Nintendo is a bit of an additive thing, anyway. It’s where you go when you can afford it or got big enough on Steam to get some attention.
I’m not gonna say it’s impossible to survive around the edges of Steam, but man, if you’re an indie dev and Valve says jump you are up in the air before you even ask how high.
I have to say, it’s crazy how many things get more palatable in these conversation when you point out that Valve does them. Microtransactions, cosmetics, NFTs, content creation guidelines… it’s a lot easier to get people to admit the upsides when it’s those guys.
Which is fair. The thing is I’m not even against most of those practices in principle, and I agree that Valve are good at making them smooth and friendly. The big exceptions are the absolute mess they made of crowdsourcing store curation and the ungodly mess of the CSGO skin grey market. And they have more than enough brand clout to get those swept under the rug. Coca Cola wishes they had the brand loyalty Valve gets.
deleted by creator
But indie devs don’t work for Valve.
I guess technically video creators don’t work for Youtube, although that one is murkier. Steam is a storefront.
Think of Amazon, actually. That’s probably a better comparison. Amazon workers work for Amazon. Their relationship with Amazon has to do with labour conditions and so on.
But if you’re a seller, or a small store that tries to sell online your relationship with Amazon is not a labour relationship but it’s still extremely asymmetrical. You have no power in that dynamic.
I mean, you’re absolutely right, that’s modern late-stage capitalism. The astounding thing is how well Valve manages to position itself outside that. Just look at all the pushback that pointing that out gets you in this and other threads. Poeple HATE the idea that Valve exists in that space. “Good guy Valve” is deeply ingrained and it demands that you think about them in a different way than Amazon and Youtube.
deleted by creator
There’s nuance to it. You can’t ever get good enough at driving that Uber gives you a special deal, and you aren’t selling each of your rides to people on multiple services at once. The power dynamic isn’t quite as lopsided, at least not for everybody.
But… it’s also not completely different, especially for the smaller devs. Valve definitely comes from that same tech upstart mentality, and it only drifted further into it as they stopped being primarily a game developer and became primarily a storefront.
deleted by creator
Piracy and its interactions with indie development are way more nuanced than that, but sure, yeah, Valve is a corporation like any other corporation. That’s all I’m saying.
That their branding work spares them a lot of criticism and judgement from the same industry-standard practices that are seen as an affront elsewhere in both game development and the larger online content creation industry.
To add to this comment, remember that the base cut is 30%, but it goes down to 25% and later to 20% as the game reaches certain thresholds of revenue. This isn’t meant to shake down the large corporations (indies benefit the least from this policy), but to make their system appealing enough to developers large enough to be able to try their luck somewhere else.