A district judge in Wisconsin has sided with an 11-year-old trans girl over her use of the girls’ toilets and temporarily blocked school officials from preventing her access.
Good! Republicans need to get over their obsession with trans children’s genitals.
gender neutral bathrooms are the answer here.
most public places have them now, don’t get why you can’t have one in a school.
In places with large crowds, gender neutral bathrooms (assuming you also mean single-use) don’t really work. It causes massive lines.
Not to mention, there’s no need. It’s a bathroom. Why does anyone care who they pee or poop next to? It seems so silly and arbitrary to me. Just get in, do your thing, wash your hands, and get out. haha
We can have gender neutral bathrooms where we have a shared hand-washing area, and individual stalls. Heck, you can even have cameras pointed towards the sink area if people are so afraid of getting harassed in the bathroom. Gender should not matter when you have individual stalls.
Right? I’ve been using public restrooms for a long time and I don’t recall ever seeing anyone’s naughty bits.
…and for me the most ridiculous part of this discussion is that bathrooms have never been a secure space. If some creep wanted to go into a bathroom to harass people, there is literally nothing stopping them. It’s not like bathrooms have guarded entrances and now people have a sneaky way to get into a bathroom by pretending to be transgender or something insane like that.
It’s literally a manufactured issue to get the GOP electorate terrified, as everything they do is designed to do.
While this is welcome news, it’s also depressing that we live in a timeline stupid enough that bathroom panics are enough of a thing that there are laws on the books like this to be struck down by judges (and of course, the fact that other judges are likely to reverse this ruling).
Would you be ok with 17 year old boys to use the girls toilets at school if they just say that they identify as a girl?
Two things to ponder if you dont understand why people might answer “yes.”: Boys pissing in public on trees and in bushes is a normal thing, especially among circles expressing concern about a society that acknowledges trans people exist. Boys using toilets is a plus, at all ages. Second: every Porta potty in existence seems to operate with its gender neutrality without the same kind of panic. If you can square these two notions: Boys using a toilet isn’t odd, strange, or worth a moral panic. You might then see your question isn’t about toilets, and about gendered space and how important it is to have spaces that are exclusive and exclusionary based on something like gender, (or even… other things!)
Of course my point is about having separate spaces that are exclusive to the two sexes. Males commit the overwhelmingly large percentage of sex crimes. Giving males free access to women’s safe spaces is not going to end well.
You’re making the unnecessary leap of toilets>sex. And then further to sex>sex crimes. This is why I mentioned portapotties. These are gender neutral public toilets found all over the nation. Are portapotties offensive? Sexual dens?
Toilets and bathrooms are perfectly functional as gender neutral spaces. The insistence that a transperson using the bathroom that aligns with their gender is somehow an invitation for sex crime just doesn’t have much basis.
Portapotties are single person. You’re not walking around in a portapotty with other people. There’s no possibility of someone peeping under/over the stall wall in a portapotty.
Most public toilets are not gender neutral, they’re male and female.
Again - it’s not that the trans person will assault someone, it’s the fact that it eliminates it as a “safe space” where women can go knowing there won’t be men in there. If you let trans women in you’re letting biological men in, meaning any man can now use that space simply by saying they identify as a woman.
Ah, got it. You don’t seem to be parsing between sex and gender here, which is probably why this is going to be a troublesome topic every time it comes up.
I mean you extrapolate from “biological men” into “any man” way too casually to have a serious opinion on this topic.
I mean, jist wait to you hear about this thing called homosexuality. No bathroom will be safe anywhere from anyone if people know about that!
Public toilets are sex based, not gender. They are male and female. They have existed since long before gender “wasn’t a binary”.
A biological female that identifies as a man can’t use the urinals, can they? No, because they don’t have a penis. Toilets have always been made to accommodate the different sexes, not genders.
The obvious solution is to make available an additional bathroom that is universally available to anyone.
Err… this simply isn’t true.
Children are fucking brutal and always looking for ways to put others down. Just because you don’t see it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. Remember when we were kids?
I’ve never understood why I should care where someone else goes to the bathroom anyways.
I wouldn’t want my boy showing genitals to women on a bathroom. Viceversa too
What world do you live in that you see other people’s genitals in the bathroom? I’ve never had this issue, none of my friends have, and I doubt you could provide any significant proof that is an issue. You just hate trans people. Say the quiet part out loud.
That’s exactly the point. The judge sided with the 11 year old girl so she wouldn’t be forced to use the boys bathroom with your son.
This is some good Accidental Ally material.
Maybe teach your boy not to show their genitals to people in the bathroom because that’s actually weird af? I swear the people against this are telling on themselves. You’re a bunch of bathroom perverts and you think it’s normal/everyone does it. Because I have never once in my whole life seen someone’s genitals in a public bathroom. You looking for it or what?
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I don’t know what bathrooms you’ve been in, but nobody is showing anyone anything in the bathroom. In most cases people who are trans use stalls anyways.
Most is not all and source of that statistic?
If you think about it… She wants to use the girl’s toilets. I’d assume there’ll only be stalls.
I use most because I can’t definitively say all.
Logically Trans people are in situations where they are going to be in individual stalls.
Like I said, nobody is showing off their genitals in the bathroom. I regret to inform you that you’re doing something wrong if you’re walking into a bathroom with the purpose of exposing yourself to the occupants.
As a male, I’ve learned long ago when I step up to a stall next to another dude, I’m not supposed to look at their genitals. As it turns out, dudes don’t like when other dudes look at their junk. As a result, I’ve never had another dude showing me their genitals in a men’s room.
Come to think of it, if I had a choice, I’d probably rather a woman looked at my junk in the bathroom than a dude…
Yeah and that’s the point, to keep it that way. No transsexuals indecently exposing themselves or perving on unconsenting kids or adults on bathrooms. Thanks for agreeing on that.
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Precisely that, to waste time and resources in pursuing the goal of collapsing the functioning of the united states government. It has been the goal of the republican party since at least Regan and likely Nixon.
Making people feel hopeless is a great use of their efforts. They want power, and to get that power they have to disenfranchise people who don’t disagree with them. So getting people to voluntarily ignore politics because it is (they are) ugly is a valid end result.
Really, at 11?
Yes? 11 is an age where children often are hitting puberty and if someone is trans, that’s when gender dysphoria would become more pronounced.
Well, at what age did you start to believe you were cis?
Bigots are incapable of thinking this way. They only see LGBT+ people as “the other” and themselves as “normal”, so they never realize that they themselves at one point figured out their own identity (including both gender and sexuality). They think it’s only LGBT+ folks having to figure those things out.
It’s bizarre, especially since society does push cisgendered and heterosexual norms at a very early age. Young boys will get asked if they like any girls and they’ll constantly be pushed with gender roles and stereotypes for their birth gender. It’s so normalized that most folks don’t even seem to realize that it happens until confronted with the existence of any alternative (like LGBT+ folks). A reasonable person would examine their biases and realize stuff like “huh, I guess I knew my gender from a young age”, but bigots have this irrational hatred for LGBT+ people so they’re not willing or capable of this kind of insight. Their brain has to twist logic into justifying the bigotry that they’ve already concluded on.
Meanwhile I feel like there’s a much bigger issue going on. 11 years old? Did they even go through puberty yet?
Why would they need to go through puberty? Did you not know what gender you were before puberty?
Plus, if you figure out you’re trans (or might be trans) that young, you’d usually take puberty blockers explicitly to delay puberty until you’re a bit older and doctors can be more certain, at which point HRT can be started. Puberty blockers are very safe and reversible, unlike puberty (whether natural puberty or HRT puberty).
Puberty blockers are very safe and reversible
This is 100% incorrect btw.
https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/puberty-blockers-not-so-reversible-after-all/
https://wng.org/roundups/study-effects-of-puberty-blockers-can-last-a-lifetime-1617220389
https://www.transgendertrend.com/nhs-no-longer-puberty-blockers-reversible/
The FDA doesn’t even approve puberty blockers for “gender affirmation”.
You can’t just “pause” puberty and then go through it years later completely unaffected. That’s not how it works.
Let’s see…
Right-wing rag, right-wing rag that has the phrase “Biblical truth” in its slogan, right-wing rag pushing vaccine conspiracies and transphobia on its front page, aaand… anti-trans hate group.
Your bias is showing.
My “bias” was literally go to google and search, then grab the ones that had studies and scientists/doctors backing them up. The NHS no longer says that puberty blockers are reversible. It doesn’t matter what site reports it, they’re reporting facts.
What I take from this is that you know they’re right, you just want to deflect because you have no actual response.
Nah, you just grabbed whatever shitty articles backed up your existing viewpoint because if you’d bothered to do any actual research you’d have seen that at worst there’s a hell of a lot more nuance than the anti-trans bigotry you spewed all over the thread:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9793415/
https://www.healthline.com/health/are-puberty-blockers-reversible
Oh, and please note that my sources are from official government sources and peer-reviewed journals, not transphobic right-wing rags that are pushing agendas.
I wonder how many 11 year old trans girls still identify as trans 10 years later. Do you believe it’s 100%?
Trans folk still identify as Trans indefinitely in about 94% of cases. Evidence suggests many of the other 6% are bullied, harassed, or threatened as a factor in their changing the way they identify.
Or was that a rhetorical question?
What happens when she’ll be 42?
