• hitmyspot@aussie.zone
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    1 year ago

    So, no warning, indiscriminate attacks that will,purposely harm civilians? This is awful. Hamas have already said they will execute hostages if there are unwarned attacks, so we can expect this to escalate on both sides.

    • HurlingDurling@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      Sadly, yes. Israel is probably getting ready for an ethnic cleansing of the Gaza strip. As per the hostages, it seems like Israel has deemed them as dead already.

    • quindraco@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      From the linked article, emphasis mine:

      In certain circumstances, [roof knocking] will be used, the source says, but today Israel is already evacuating masses of the Gaza populace from central terrorist areas and attacking there.

      • hitmyspot@aussie.zone
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        1 year ago

        There are also reports of people being ordered to leave their homes and head to the cbd, which is then bombed. It’s a warzone, though, so I’m sure we won’t get fully accurate information.

      • Deceptichum@kbin.social
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        1 year ago

        Like if they weren’t denied basic rights and locked up in a ghetto for decades to be indiscriminately murdered by Israel as they colonise Palestine?

        If only…

          • ???@lemmy.worldOP
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            1 year ago

            Sorry what does that mean? Nearly half of the Jordanian population are ethnically Palestinian.

            I have seen this argument before. Could you explain what you mean by “them” and what you mean by Jordan not accepting them?

            • 520@kbin.social
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              1 year ago

              As in, the country of Jordan does not let them in because they can’t handle a sudden influx of 2 million people?

              Think I’ve also answered the question as to how this would likely go, though.

              • ???@lemmy.worldOP
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                1 year ago

                Jordan has opened its borders to Iraqi, Palestinians, Syrians, etc. They have a general policy of taking in refugees. I don’t think Jordan does a good job treating those refugees well, but it’s almost a diplomatic certainty that Jordan would let them in.

                So what exactly are you basing your opinion on?

              • Deceptichum@kbin.social
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                1 year ago

                What do you think removing peoples from their land is?

                Your solution is for them to leave their homeland before they’re killed. That’s ethnic cleansing by result.

            • suction@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              How do you know they’re “indiscriminate“? Isn’t that a spin in itself that proves you’re not neutral? (Hint: it is)

              • I am very much neutral.

                Go through my Comment History and you’ll see how much i hate both sides

                Actually, i’ll save you the work. Here: https://lemmy.world/comment/4367347

                But to answer your questions: Israel itself has announced it.

                Cutting off Food and Energy from the entirety of Gaza doesn’t seem very targeted to me, does it?

                If anything, you are biased. You are hellbent on making the Israelis look like the good guys here, unwilling to admit that sometimes there is no good guy and both sides are absolute shit

                • suction@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  If you move the goal posts, you’re not neutral. People are taking Hamas’ side IN THIS INCIDENT, but Israel wouldn’t have done anything what they’re doing since two days if Hamas hadn’t attacked the day before.

                  If people deny that fact and start to point to past events or the overall situation, they aren’t serious people and can simply be ignored.

                  Hamas attacked first.

    • jcit878@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      maybe hamas shouldn’t have killed hundreds of civilians purely to provoke a response? maybe the Palestinians should leave now? maybe they shouldn’t vote a dead cult like Hamas in as their government?

      • ???@lemmy.worldOP
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        1 year ago

        Yes, Hamas should absolutely not have killed a single Israeli civilian or any civilian period. But none of your maybes justify more killing of civilians in Gaza.

        Even if people in Gaza, who are constantly all their lives between a rock and a hard place with no clean water and no future prospects, voted for Hamas, still it does not justify Israel killing civilians.

        • jcit878@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          I never said it ‘justifies’ it. Unless the civilians clear out, it is unfortunately inevitable. The difference is israelies arent going to be using their forces specifically to target civilians, unlike the other lot of animals

        • Hyperreality@kbin.social
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          1 year ago

          none of your maybes justify more killing of civilians in Gaza.

          War is war.

          If the allies had avoided making any civilian casulties, the nazis would have won the war.

            • Hyperreality@kbin.social
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              1 year ago

              It’s not ethical. It’s war. War isn’t like in the movies.

              Hitler could have spent the war in an appartment in the middle of Berlin, safe in the knowledge no one would ever dare bomb him. Stalin could have nuked NATO, safe in the knowledge NATO wouldn’t ever retaliate. If we allowed monsters who hide between civilians get away with it, they would inherit the earth. ISIS could tie a few civilians to the top of their tank, and murder us all. The Lord’s Resistance Army could have freely marched into town to procure a few more child sex slaves, because they were protected by the children they had previously abducted.

              There are no good guys or bad guys in this conflict. Both sides have stolen land. A third of Israel’s population are ‘arab’ jews. They’ve lived in the region for millenia, and have just as much right to a country as the Palestinians. Let’s not pretend they’d be safe in a Palestinian state or welcomed if they fled to neighbouring countries, given how popular Mein Kampf still is in the region. You’d be exchanging defacto Apartheid for genocide.

              And let’s not pretend that the Israelis have always undermined the peace process. For example, it’s no coincidence that Israeli politics shifted to the right after 2000, when Arafat walked away from further negotiations at Camp David, something even the Saudi ambassador described as criminal, and despite the Israeli PM offering far reaching and deeply unpopular concessions. Of course, Israel also helped Hamas’ rise to power, so once again no good guys or bad guys.

              It’s a mess and now it’s a messy war.

              All we can do is urge both sides to limit civilian casulties, not target them deliberately, but they are inevitable.

      • SeaJ@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        Where the fuck do you expect over 2 million Palestinians to go? They can’t exactly walk right into Israel.

        • jcit878@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          so hamas is a terroist dictatorship. who broke into their neighboors place, slaughtered hundreds of innocents for no reason at all, kidnapped dozens more and threaten to kill them, and these are the guys you think are awesome

          least bloodthirsty lemming

      • InfiniteGlitch@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        1 year ago

        I said this in another thread and I will say it again here:

        I always find it odd how people blame “extremists” and the Palestinians for this.

        Israel starts to steal homes, land and killing men, children and women. No one bat an eye to that.

        Then extremists and hate towards Israel came and bam, they are the bad ones suddenly.

        Certainly what Hamas does is entirely wrong however - People cannot expect them be silent and get killed by Israeli forces.

        This is what happens from decades upon decades of oppression.

        This entire conflict was created by Israel stealing land and starting a genocide mission on Palestinians.

        • jcit878@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          they are the bad ones suddenly.

          In my eyes, yes. I was absolutely a ‘both sides are as bad as each other’ person 3 days ago. Now Its obvious one side is objectively worse and crossed a line that cant be walked back without serious blood and retribution

          • ???@lemmy.worldOP
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            1 year ago

            Israel crossed that line every single day. Literally every single day for 75 years.

            • jcit878@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              yeah well when you go and massacre innocents any ‘greivance’ you have can go take a hike

              • ???@lemmy.worldOP
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                1 year ago

                So if Israel can bomb Gaza for the actions of Hamas, by that logic (which I strongly disagree with), Hamas can also go around bombing Israel because they kill civilians on the fly.

                Right?

          • Deceptichum@kbin.social
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            1 year ago

            Israel crossed that line and continues to cross it every year.

            You don’t care.

            Hamas crosses the line once, you’re magically no longer concerned with the suffering of the Palestinians.

            Give me a break, what a cop-out answer.

            • Uranium3006@kbin.social
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              1 year ago

              lots of horrible people exposing themselves as not caring about innocent people caught in the crossfire of this war like this

            • jcit878@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              you support terrorism and the slaughtering of innocents. You would be right at home with the protestors in sydney today chanting ‘gas the jews’ (yes, they literally were saying that)

              • Lmaydev@programming.dev
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                1 year ago

                Isn’t that exactly what Israel is proposing to do in retaliation? And let’s be honest has been doing for decades.

                It’s completely fucked and both sides are awful.

                But it’s the civilians on both sides that pay the highest price.

                • jcit878@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  both sides are fucked, but no, israel is not proposing to go in specifically to murder civilians and target civilians.

          • InfiniteGlitch@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            1 year ago

            Hypocrisy at its finest.

            EDIT: so basically you are saying, you are fine with Israel killing millions upon millions of Palestinian people but when it Hamas is doing the exact same thing that’s wrong.

            EDIT 2: how can you be “be for both sides”? One side is committing genocide and the other is fighting for their right to live. Hamas was literally created around 1987s to fight back for Palestinians lives.

            When peaceful revolution is impossible, violence revolution is inevitable.