Post had nothing to do with murder or violence. It is clear who reddit serves.
They’re scared of anything that challenges their position even subtly. So they remove posts like this to avoid questioning the narrative. Hopefully their efforts will backfire with the Streisand effect.
Because they own the platform.
Hence, why Lemmy was needed.
Lemmy’s security is largely in its obscurity. If the community ever gains the degree of popularity or prominence as Reddit, it will succumb to all the same socio-economic pressures.
Hell, Reddit’s origin story isn’t far off from Lemmy’s. A left-wing FOSS guy pioneers a novel means of aggregating information in a relatively decentralized and community-oriented way. But then the capitalists move in, he’s arrested, the administration of the site is auctioned off to VCs, and the site is slowly mutated into an echo chamber for neoliberal propagandists and reactionary agitators to scream at one another, drowning everything else out.
Lemmyites want to believe they’ve engineered a technical solution to what is ultimately a socio-economic problem. The human labor that makes Lemmy work can be attacked and replaced, the communities that form alienated from one another and censored by moderators and dispersed, and the popularity monetized here just like has happened elsewhere.
This isn’t a safe social media space. Its just a lingering redoubt in an internet that’s been under siege for decades.
As I understand it, the fediverse as a whole is composed of instances, each one communicating with whichever other instances it wishes (the instances acting as social medias of sorts). Each instance is created by people making their own thing, so if one large instance (such as Lemmy.world) were to get taken over by filthy capitalists, someone could simply make a new, separate instance and choose not to federate with Lemmy world. Is this not the case?
if one large instance (such as Lemmy.world) were to get taken over by filthy capitalists, someone could simply make a new, separate instance and choose not to federate with Lemmy world.
Websites get traded on the backend regularly without hemorrhaging their userbases. A large site is going to have a degree of inertia. People aren’t going to all simultaneously pick up out of .world and go to .world2 because someone on le.mee or .shi.tjustworks talks shit about the mods. There’s too much of a trust deficit, just for starters. And it would be a two-way street if it wasn’t (people in .world claiming le.mee was the one that got taken over and you should decamp from them to our instance).
Past that, you can always make a new website even before federation. The trick is then getting a working community to include you in their network of links and shares. Federation makes that process more explicit and more pronounced. But most local instances have learned not to federate with everyone in the fediverse (because there’s so much gnarly shit out there), which means doing promotion and negotiation to get your new instance recognized by the survivors.
In a single case of a single instance getting taken over, migration is possible if a bit painful. But if it happens repeatedly, thanks to a professional business team going after instances strategically while individual largely-ignorant users have to respond organically, then the Fediverse doesn’t have a chance over the long term. Eventually, the business interest gets control of enough high profile domains and pollutes the means of interpersonal communication to such a high degree that you either trust your instance or you abandon the Fediverse entirely.
It becomes a game of “Who Is The Werewolf?”, which strategically favors the werewolves.
Reddit was never FOSS. Linux is still going stong, even with vested financial interests.
Most importantly, wie have already made the decision to leave traditional social media and build something better. If worst comes to wiorst, we’ll find each other again.
Reddit was never FOSS.
Reddit went full open-source in 2008 with a Github repo, did a (possibly deliberately) poor job of maintaining the repo despite this source code resulting in a plethora of 3rd party site enhancements and feature suites, then ultimately close its code nine years later.
Linux is still going stong, even with vested financial interests.
RedHat did Linux extremely dirty, and they’re hardly the first. It also has a significantly larger, more skilled, and more international userbase.
Most importantly, wie have already made the decision to leave traditional social media and build something better.
That’s a beautiful lie. Lemmy’s federation has been its pioneering feature, but it continues to backslide into Reddit-with-Extra-Steps. If anyone could claim they were building something truly novel, it was Mastadon. But that complexity and novelty has been an albatross around their necks since day one.
If worst comes to wiorst, we’ll find each other again.
:-/
This is really one of the biggest problem we have. They influence elections, they influence public opinion, they spin the narrative as they want.
But have you throught about the parasite being uncomfortable because peasants meme Luigi tho?
They want to establish the narrative of Luigi-the-terrorist, but human beings know who is the reasonable one.
human beings know who is the reasonable one
I remember people saying that about Julian Assange and Edward Snowden twenty years ago. It didn’t take long for popular opinion to turn on them, though. Just call the whistleblowers allies of the opposition party or props of an evil foreign government. Americans hate that. And the American public soured on them rapidly, as a result.
That’s why we need to stop relying on idols and figureheads. I dont even necessarily think we need to organize, but to act as individuals capable of operating independently from central leadership. Most of us have the same goal, after all. It’s just most of us are still too comfortable or afraid to do anything, and that’s because we invested too much in leaders or orgs that we watch get assassinated and destroyed. But they can’t get all of us, especially if we act independently, and soon.
Posting an image of a person who is known to everyone as the (suspected) murderer of a capitalist, whom he explicitly murdered for his capitalistic practices, and referring to a distinct but similar set of calitalistic practices is not “a non-violent Luigi post”. It’s not directly calling for violence, sure. But the connection is pretty clear. If the Right did something like that, we’d probably call it a ((likely intentionally) poorly disguised) dog whistle.
I’m not saying the post is evil and ban-worthy. Which side an action is done for matters. You might say, the ends justify the means. But get your terminology right, and shed the centrists’ illusions. And non-violence is an illusion. This is the propaganda theatre of a class war. And Reddit is fighting for the enemy.
Thats the point. They are banning class warfare; not violence.
If the billionaires aren’t getting mad at this, they are getting something good from it. Most likely in the form of extreme tax cuts (and the moral type of fraud). They’d have less capital but more for themselves.
The moment Robber Barons were first stopped, they starting working to rig things so they are never stopped again.
The only way to remind them that they have no such power is the French way.
All Tesla dealerships should be on fire by now. Now protected by a wall of obese ‘police’ that would not pass the most lenient tests to join the police force in any country of the EU.
Now that I’m no longer on Reddit, I feel that I can finally speak my mind.
The only way we will be able to get rid of the billionaires is if we drag them out of their mansions by their hair and stick them into a guillotine. We need to face that they are too powerful for the law to take care of, and I doubt they will let themselves be taxed out of their riches. The only way to get rid of the dragon is to decapitate it.
Case in point, the richest one is currently dismantling the world’s most powerful government from the inside, with impunity
They’re immune to laws. They’re immune to protests. Their money is untouchable. But they’re touchable. Nobody is immune to ballistics. Nobody really wants to open box number four but I fear we are there.
Hear hear. Hate to quote Dorito Mussolini, but “he who saves the world breaks no laws.”
I mean, its true. The American Revolutionaries were committing treason until they won against the British.
If you win, your new judicial system would legalized everything you did.
Yeah, it was real nice of him to point that out for the rest of us 😀
The monopoly men have worked very hard over the past one hundred years to stamp out class consciousness in the US. They won’t give in without a fight.
Bootlickers is the battle ground
If owners control them, they win
If they gain class solidarity, owners lose
Saying that the post has nothing to do with violence is pretty dishonest. Why do you think that the person who made the meme used Luigi Mangione instead of Bernie Sanders?
A person can be an idol/totem/icon of resistance. The post does not incite violence, nor does it display any violence. It does not break any rules.
Listen, I don’t think the post should have been removed, but I don’t think what you said is necessarily true. While obviously an extreme to make my point, if there was a non-violent quote from Hitler, nobody would bat an eye when it gets quickly removed. Of course Luigi isn’t the same as Hitler, but a case can be made that at a certain point the persons appearance is enough to make a statement, regardless of the quote in the post.
Of course, it’s different because nearly everyone on this platform supports the movement that Luigi represented (myself included).
You are comparing guerilla partisan resistance (from evil) with something that’s being resisted against (evil) and saying they both represent violence.
I think that’s not correct.
Some people that turn to violence in order to protect the weak are (treated as) heros.
Either way the post didn’t explicitly or implicitly encourage violence and should’ve stayed up.
Why do you think that the person who made the meme used Luigi Mangione instead of Bernie Sanders?
Because Luigi everything has been getting censored by establishment media?
I agree. At most send an advisory message reminding the poster of rules and not to post worse. AT MOST. And I say that as someone who condemns the CEO murder and I don’t agree with Luigi being glorified in any way.
If you think that using Luigi Mangione in a post about the wealthy and elite doesn’t imply violence against those people, then we are simply going to have to disagree and I frankly think you are being intellectually dishonest.
Counterpoint: why did police and media parade Luigi around as if he were guilty? What if Luigi is completely unrelated to Thompson’s death? Police departments want us to think he’s guilty and violent, his case is a lot more about legal injustice than violence right now. But hell if they want us to think about violence, we’ll do it but in a way that doesn’t empower corporate elites.
It’s also about freedom of speech. I’m on Lemmy due to Reddit bans. Did I imply I was going to be violent? No. Just talking about Luigi will get you banned, Reddit appears to be complying in advance to political pressure. Why else would they care?
I am not defending Reddit. I don’t even use it. I don’t really understand how anything you said was a counterpoint, they are different topics. Regardless of if Luigi Mangione did or did not do it, or if it was or was not justified, is entirely irrelevant to what using him in a meme right now explicitly about the wealthy elite is implying.
The post talks about social media being owned by elites. It’s implying rampant censorship by social media, like Reddit, and also a twist on his story to make him look guilty without due process. I don’t know where you got the implication of violence from, you didn’t explain it yourself.
It does make me feel violently angry! But not because of Luigi, because of the billionaire’s evil actions towards us all.
Why did the meme creator take a well known Bernie Sanders meme, someone who is already fairly well regarded for standing up for the working class, and alter it to show Luigi Mangione instead?
Like it or not, the man is a symbol for being fed up with being abused, killed, and sickened for profit. That sentiment transcends violence, which btw hasn’t been proven yet.
I don’t think the image of Luigi is only about violence. It’s also a recognition of people’s pain at the hands of the ultra rich corporate elite. He symbolizes sticking it to the man, not just blind proletariat mob violence.
Many of us enjoyed the national unity that came from recognizing universal suffering at the hands of the US medical industry.
When did I say blind proletariat mob violence? I said violence. You threw those three extra words on there. He symbolizes sticking it to the man… By way of violence.
Who’s being intellectually dishonest again??
You implied proletariat mob violence. See what I did there?
No, I genuinely don’t. I don’t think you are taking this conversation very seriously so I’ll say good day to you.
You’re really good at projecting.
Allegedly
Removed by mod
Whose boot am I licking, and how? Could you be more specific?
Removed by mod
I’m stating facts, not shilling anything. I don’t use Reddit and don’t care what they do or do not delete. I’m not advocating for or against Reddit’s position on this meme.
I’m pointing out that OP is either lying or ignorant if they think that this meme isn’t implying violence. That’s it.
You got a lot to learn about how the world works. But if you do understand and you still coming in here with this brain dead take. This is a boot licker behavior and I hope they treat you well enough to shill against your class interest.
I’m so confused. Presumably, you approve of what Luigi Mangione did - please correct me if I’m assuming wrong there. But proceeding assuming I’m right about that, isn’t violence the point?
Based on this I am going to assume you have not experienced enough of the life to understand what this is really about.
So I guess less of a bootlicker and more of a useful idiot then.
Unless you are part of the club… Then you are just shilling your class interest
Hmm
It made you post a comment though, would you have paid as much attention if it were yet another Bernie meme?
For the record, I’m just playing Devil’s advocate above. I agree that using Luigi Mangione in political memes inherently carries the connotation of violence.
I actually commented more because of OP’s insanely disingenuous take on the content. But, I don’t understand what that has anything to do with my statement though. I didn’t assert or deny that Luigi Mangione drives engagement. You might as well have replied to me with “llamas are pretty cute though”.
It is because Spez is a corporate shill taking that sweet sweet Russian oligarch and Chinese investor money while he bleeds users and data.
Peter Thiel is an American oligarch. He has funded reddit from the beginning. Then later on Andreessen and Altman.
Which Russian oligarchs fund reddit? And I very much doubt the 3 hundred million from Tencent holds much sway considering how virulently anti-China reddit is.
Let’s try the same text with a Nazi salute. Maybe even a literal photo of Hitler. I wonder if they’ll stay up. (I expect they will)
You have to use his full name “Luigi Mario” so it doesn’t get taken down.
It’s not only who they serve that is on full display, it what those in power fear most
They fear it so much that they are ruthlessly crushing it across all social media platforms
I feel like the US at this point is a lost cause. The corpos have accumulated way too much lobbying power over the past few years. They will never allow real progressive candidates win major elections. Democrats now have to play the center in order to not upset the corporations. We lost our last real chance to make meaningful change with Bernie in 2016…
Bernie in 2016
DNC komissars denied us that because it was “her turn”
And they have been denying pro worker candidates ever since.
NGL if ya’lls ability to make rational appeals inherently relies on Luigi Mangione worship then you’re going to have a very difficult time just in general.
Even just using the un-photo-shopped Bernie Sanders original could swing the bias almost 50% in your favor when approaching the general public with your ideals.
Everybody loves Bernie. Only 18% approve of what Luigi did.
In your link below, 18% only includes “strong positive”. Why exclude “somewhat positive”?
Edit (correcting numbers as pointed out): 31% positive, 41% negative for the under-45 respondents. 19% positive, 61% negative overall.
It’s actually 19%, including both levels of support. Reading is hard for people I guess.
And for the record, 61% held a negative view. So OP is completely correct here.
Ah, you are right regarding the full dataset. Thank you.
It’s strange that they start off with, and seem to focus on, the under-45 respondents unless they were trying to push a positive-viewpoint message. For that age group, it was 31% positive and 41% negative. However, this group seems like a better fit for the Lemmy/Reddit audience. Furthermore, left-leaning voters appear to be more positive in this poll than their right-leaning counterparts.
With all that in mind, I still think this meme works well and wouldn’t have been improved with Bernie.
I just want people to understand that just because many people on Lemmy love Luigi doesn’t mean there’s some secret silent majority in real life that does too. Most people don’t want to see people shot down in the streets, regardless of who they are. It makes them feel like they or their family might be next.
I think they framed the story that way because to boomers the level of support among younger people is the most shocking thing about this poll. To those of us in that demographic it seems a strange way to do it because that’s just how it is for us, so it’s not that noteworthy.
Why exclude “somewhat positive”?
Because they’re making their argument in bad faith, or they stopped after getting the part they wanted and didn’t bother looking any further.
Who is ‘they’? The ‘somewhat positive’ people are bad faith, or finitebanjo is bad faith?
finitebanjo
This one. Sorry for the confusion.
finitebanjo has some pretty obvious ‘lying with statistics’ vibes. He said only 18% approved of Luigi’s actions when I can say only 41% view Luigi’s actions as negative. They were just cherry picking some stats.
Ah yes. The vibes. Always reliable. Except it’s actually 61% negative. Should I accuse you of lying now?
You are adding ‘not sure’ as a negative. I didn’t. That’s why statistics are so much fun.
Last numbers I saw in that kinda world, where very much higher then 18% not sure where you are pulling that figure from?
The poll which came out on December 13th 2024
I dunno, that poll reads very much in favor of Luigi. The fact that a poll needs to be run in the first place for an act like this. To me anything that’s not strongly against this is showing some sort of support.
If anything it shows that less than half disapprove of Luigi’s actions. Only 41% have a negative view of his actions.
Aren’t statistics fun?
Yeah, that link shows 31%, not 18% for the under-45 respondents. Nearly a third of those have a positive approval of Luigi.
Edit: corrected to under-45 group.
That’s some insane mental gymnastics you have there…
We’re dealing with the same idiots that think they can squash dissent by no longer allowing questions on company town halls. Doing literally anything continues to frustrate the fuck out of them as they realize they don’t have a paycheck to wave at us to keep us quiet. But, yes, anyone willing to do a little heavier lifting is always welcome.
What are you even trying to express here? That’s just childish phrases glued together.
The people it is meant for know what it means. If you don’t, you’re either out of scope, or my enemy.
After all these years, people still don’t understand echo chambers.
Echo chambers are fine, as long as you don’t think they are reality and act accordingly. I am annoyed by willful ignorance, so I purposefully avoid becoming friends with willfully ignorant people. But, I remember that they exist and when they come after marginalized people, I am not afraid to engage them.
Yeah but few people seem to have this ability. I’m not sure it’s human nature. People tend to uncritically accept the opinions and statements of their peers as fact.
Maybe you are exceptional and this doesn’t apply but I tend to think it applies to everyone to some extent.
I’m not exceptional. I’m the same piece of shit as everyone else 😂 you’re right though, it doesn’t hurt to remind people to be cautious of them.
Yeah part of me wants to think I am immune but I think that’s my cognitive bias at work. But I do think I’m more skeptical than the average person, even if I’m not completely immune. People who think about and recognize these issues might have an extra layer of defense, if imperfect.
you actually can be pretty close to immune, vaccinated you might say, through meditation. you become very aware of how your thoughts arise, and how they really are not you. and the difference between thoughts and thinking.
the ol’ “try to think of what your next thought will be, and you won’t be able to” thing. But, sounds like you’ve already been practicing some self-awareness.
